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AMERICAN SOCIETY OF HEATING, REFRIGERATING AND AIR-CONDITIONING ENGINEERS, INC.

1791 Tullie Circle, N.E./Atlanta, GA 30329

404-636-8400

TC/TG/TRG MINUTES COVER SHEET

 

(Minutes of all TC/TG/TRG Meetings are to be distributed to all persons listed below within 60 days following the meeting.)

TC/TG/TRG NO.: 1.8 DATE: March 16, 1996

TC/TG/TRG TITLE: Owning and Operating Costs

DATE OF MEETING: February 21, 1996 LOCATION: Atlanta, GA

MEMBERS PRESENT	YEAR APPTD	MEMBERS ABSENT	YEAR APPTD	EX-OFFICIO MEMBERS AND ADDITIONAL ATTENDANCE
Kirk Bond Mil Buckley Nance Lovvorn Wayne Robertson Peter Rojeski Bill Thomaston Joe Watson	94 94 92 94 93 93			Joel Anderson Van Baxter Bevin Bilton Mike Braswell Barry Bridges Jim Carelock Alan Chalifoux Terry Cornell David Guckelberger Sheila Hayter Rick Hermans Carl Hiller Christine Kjellman William McCartney Ken McGrath Wayne Robertson Jim Schlachter Mark Taylor David Underwood Wayne Webster John Wolfert

DISTRIBUTION:

ALL MEMBERS OF TC/TG/TRG

R&T SECTION HEAD: Van D. Baxter

ALL COMMITTEE LIAISONS AS SHOWN ON TC/TG/TRG ROSTERS:

Program Committee: Ed Gut

Journal: Alice Riddle Belt

Handbook: Ron Shelton

Staff (Research): Bill Seaton

Staff (Standards): Jim Heldenbrand

Staff (Tech. Services): Clarie Barrett

ADDITIONAL DISTRIBUTION: TC 1.8 corresponding members not attending meeting

 

            ASHRAE TC/TG/TRG ACTIVITIES SHEET

DATE: March 16, 1996

TC/TG/TRG NO.: 1.8 TC/TG/TRG TITLE: Owning and Operating Costs

CHAIRMAN: Wayne Robertson VICE CHAIRMAN: Wayne Webster SECRETARY: Sheila Hayter_______________

TC/TG/TRG MEETING SCHEDULE
Location-Past 12 Months		Date		Location-Planned Next 12 Months		Date
San Diego, CA Chicago, IL		6/25/95 1/30/95		San Antonio, TX Philadelphia, PA		6/24/96 1/27/97
TC/TG/TRG SUBCOMMITTEES
Function				Chairman
Handbook Program Research				David Guckelberger Peter Rojeski Joe Watson
RESEARCH PROJECTS-CURRENT
Project Title	Contractor		Monitoring Comm. Chpt.		Report Made At Meeting
Impact of Staff Training on Operating and Maintenance Costs	Engineering Interface, Ltd.		Wayne Webster		Project near completion. TC 1.8 will vote on final report at San Antonio meeting (June 1996)
LONG RANGE RESEARCH PLAN
Rank Title	W/S Written		Apprv.		To R&T
1. HVAC Maintenance Cost 2. Replacement Intervals and Service Life for HVAC Equipment and Systems 3. Operating Cost 4. Installed Costs 5. The Impact of Commissioning HVAC Systems on Life Cycle Costs - Preventative Maintenance 6. Investment Methodology on District Energy Systems 7. Diagnostic Tools for Maintenance and Operating Cost Optimization 8. The Economic Benefits of Preventative Maintenance Programs 9. Investment Analysis Guide for Upgrading EMCS	Yes   Draft   No No No   No   No   No   No		No   No   No No No   No   No   No   No		No   No   No No No   No   No   No   No

        (OVER PLEASE)

 

HANDBOOK RESPONSIBILITIES
Year & Volume	Chapter Title	No.	Deadline	Handbook Subcom Liaison
1999 Applications	33 Owning and Operating Costs		6/96 first draft	Ron Shelton
STANDARDS ACTIVITIES-List and Describe Subjects
none
TECHNICAL PAPERS from Sponsored Research-Title, when presented (past 3 yrs. present & planned)
Impact of Staff Training on Operating and Maintenance Costs - to be submitted for review, summer 1996
TC/TG Sponsored Symposia-Title, when presented (past 3 yrs. present & planned)
Life Cycle Costs of Equipment - January or June 1997, Philadelphia, PA or Boston, MA
TC/TG Sponsored Seminars-Title when present (past 3 yrs. present & planned)
Optimizing HVAC Life-Cycle Costs Using Predictive Performance Algorithms - January 1995, Chicago, IL The Impacts of Building Commissioning on Owning and operating Costs - June 1995, San Diego, CA Community Energy Systems - Infrastructure that Pays - June 1995, San Diego, CA Electric Utility Deregulation and Its Impact on Users - February 1996, Atlanta, GA Rebuild America, Opportunities in a New Federal Energy Program - June 1996, San Antonio, TX Impacts of Staff Training on O&M Costs - January 1997, Philadelphia, PA
TC/TG Sponsored Forums-Title, when presented (past 3 yrs. present & planned)
Why Isn’t Life-Cycle Cost Analysis Widely Used? - February 1996, Atlanta, GA
JOURNAL PUBLICATIONS, when published (past 3 yrs. present & planned)
none

       

Submitted By: Sheila J. Hayter, secretary for TC 1.8

       

Action Items

TC 1.8 Meeting

February 20, 1996

Dave Guckelberger	distribute handbook chapter to revisers (February)
handbook revisers	return revision comments to Dave Guckelberger (April)
Wayne Robertson	write letter to Richard Wright explaining that no information has been excluded from the TC 1.8 handbook chapter and summarize the concerns of TC 1.8 members for including special information in a publication other than the handbook
Peter Rojeski	prepare a seminar package for "Impacts of Staff Training on O&M Costs" for presentation at the Philadelphia meeting
Joe Watson/Jim Schlachter	prepare a seminar on evaluating HVAC systems using LCC analysis for presentation at the Philadelphia meeting
Terry Cornell	prepare a seminar on investigating the impact of utility deregulation on owning and operating cost for presentation at the Philadelphia meeting
Jim Schlachter	discuss with Peter Rojeski the possibility of TC 8.10 co-sponsoring a seminar with TC 1.8 on the LCC of equipment
Joe Watson	develop a work statement for research project 1 - HVAC Maintenance Costs
Joe Watson	develop a work statement for research project 2 - Replacement Intervals and Service Life for HVAC Equipment and Systems
Terry Cornell	develop a work statement for research project 3 - Operating Cost
Jim Schlachter	develop a work statement for research project 4 - Installed Costs
Christie Kjellman	develop a work statement for research project 5 - The Impact of Commissioning HVAC System of LCC
Jim Schlachter	discuss with TC 6.2 co-sponsorship of research project 6 - Investment Methodology on District Energy Systems
Barry Bridges	discuss with TC 1.4 co-sponsorship of research project 7 - Diagnostic Tools for Maintenance and Operating Cost Optimization
Christie Kjellman	discuss with Mary Piette of Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory her ideas about research project 7 - Diagnostic Tools for Maintenance and Operating Cost Optimization
Wayne Webster	give draft work statement he helped develop for research project 7 to Joe Watson
Wayne Webster Kirk Bond Barry Bridges Sheila Hayter Jim Schlachter	TC 9.6 co-liaison TC 9.6 co-liaison TC 9.9 liaison TC 9.1 liaison TC 6.1 liaison
Mil Buckley	ASHRAE Journal liaison

Meeting Minutes

TC 1.8, Owning and Operating Costs

February 20, 1996

Atlanta, GA

I.          Meeting convenes at 3:30 p.m.

• TC 1.8 Chair, Wayne Robertson, called the meeting to order.
• Sufficient number of voting members were present to represent a quorum.
• Voting members, corresponding members, and visitors introduced themselves.

II.         Approve the minutes from the June 1995 meeting.

• Voting members approved the minutes from the previous without changes (6 yes - 0 no - 0 abstentions - 1 absent)

III.       Handbook subcommittee report.

• David Guckelberger, handbook subcommittee chair, reported on the outcome of the handbook subcommittee meeting from February 18, 1996. Ten people attended the meeting. The subcommittee decided there are no significant errors or missing information in the existing chapter 33 of the HVAC Applications handbook. Dave will distribute the chapter to revisers in February. He asked that revisers submit comments in April so that he can have a completed draft prepared before the June meeting.
• Meeting attendees discussed a letter from Richard Wright to all TCs. In the letter, Mr. Wright asked if information was excluded from the chapters because of lack of space in the handbook and if this information would be appropriate to include in special publications. Several attendees were concerned valuable information could be forced out of the handbook and the ASHRAE membership would then be required to purchase additional publications, defeating the purpose the handbook as a comprehensive source of information. TC 1.8 members recommended that the chair, Wayne Robertson, write a letter to Richard Wright explaining no information has been excluded from the TC 1.8 chapter and to express the concerns discussed at the meeting.
• See attached handbook subcommittee minutes.

IV.       Program subcommittee report.

• Peter Rojeski, program subcommittee chair, began his report by asking TC 1.8 to approve a seminar for the San Antonio Annual Meeting (June 1996). The seminar is titled "Rebuild America, Opportunities in a New Federal Energy Program." He and Kirk Bond coordinated 5 speakers to present at this seminar and prepared the program package to be turned over to the ASHRAE Program Committee (APC). The speakers are: Mark Baily, a DOE Program Manager; Bob Haush from the Kansas City Metropolitan Energy Center, a participant in Mark Baily’s program; and Monica Stone, Tobin Harvey, and Doug Culbreth from the Iowa, Texas, and North Carolina energy offices respectively. TC 1.8 voted to accept this program (6-0-0-1). (The APC accepted this seminar for San Antonio.)
• Peter tried to coordinate a second program for San Antonio titled "Impacts of Staff Training on O&M Costs." Several people have agreed to speak but none of them submitted their abstracts in time to turn in the program package to the APC. Peter will continue to work with the speakers and have the package prepared to submit for the Philadelphia meeting (January 1997). One of the speakers will be the researcher who is nearly completed with the TC 1.8 active research project.
• Several additional seminars are planned for Philadelphia. Joe Watson and Jim Schlachter will prepare a seminar on evaluating building systems using life-cycle-cost analysis and Terry Cornell will prepare a second seminar on investigating the impact of utility deregulation on owning and operating cost.
• Kirk Bond reminded meeting attendees about the forum scheduled for the day after the TC 1.8 meeting reported in these minutes titled "Why is Life Cycle Costs Not More Widely Used?" The forum was well attended and participants actively discussed the issue.
• TC 1.8 co-sponsored a seminar with TC 1.10, Energy Resources, at the Atlanta ASHRAE meeting title "Electric Utility Deregulation and Its Impact on Users." The seminar was very well attended (over 100 people), all the speakers were informative and qualified to speak on the topic, and there was a great deal of interest and discussion from members of the audience.
• It was recommended TC 1.8 sponsor a seminar or symposium on the life cycle cost of equipment including the first cost, operating costs, etc. Meeting attendees agreed this would be an interesting program and should be submitted for the Philadelphia (January 1997) or Boston (June 1997) meetings. Jim Schlachter suggested TC 1.8 co-sponsor the program with TC 8.10, Pumps and Hydronic Piping. He will discuss this idea further with Peter.

V.        Research subcommittee report.

• Joe Watson, research subcommittee chair, recommends that TC 1.8 focus their research efforts to provide information that should be included the handbook chapter. He recommended including the following topics: maintenance costs of systems; service costs; installed costs; and operating costs. He reported those the research subcommittee reevaluated the priorities of the TC 1.8 research project ideas to meet this goal. The new prioritized research project list is:

1. HVAC Maintenance Cost - The work statement is nearly completed. TC 1.8 members should expect a fax ballot to accept the work statement near the end of February. After acceptance, the work statement will be submitted to ASHRAE. Joe is coordinating this effort.

1. Replacement Intervals and Service Life for HVAC Equipment and Systems - Joe is writing a work statement for this project and plans to have it completed before the next ASHRAE meeting (San Antonio, June 1996).

1. Operating Cost - Terry Cornell will write a work statement to present to TC 1.8 at the Philadelphia ASHRAE meeting (January 1997).

1. Installed Costs - Jim Schlachter will write a work statement to present to TC 1.8 at the Boston ASHRAE meeting (June 1997).

1. The Impact of Commissioning HVAC Systems on Life Cycle Costs - Preventative Maintenance - Christie Kjellman will develop a work statement. She presented the idea to TC 9.9, Building Commissioning, and they showed interest in co-sponsoring the project.

1. Investment Methodology on District Energy Systems - Jim Schlachter will approach TC 6.2, District Heating and Cooling, to learn if they are interest in co-sponsoring this project.

1. Diagnostic Tools for Maintenance and Operating Cost Optimization- Barry Bridges will present to TC 1.4, Control Theory and Application, to ask if they are interested in co-sponsoring the project. Christie Kjellman will discuss the issue with Mary Piette of (Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory) for her input. Kirk Bond reported that TC 1.7, Operations and Maintenance Management, is very interested in this research project and considers it a high priority. They would like to co-sponsor it with TC 1.8. Wayne Webster helped develop a work statement on this project once before. He will provide this information to Joe.

1. The Economic Benefits of Preventative Maintenance Programs

1. Investment Analysis Guide for Upgrading EMCS

• The new research plan will be formally submitted to ASHRAE at the San Antonio meeting (June 1996). All work statements to be included in this plan need to be completed before then.
• The final report for the TC 1.8 active research project, Impact of Staff Training on Operating and Maintenance Cost, is nearly completed. TC 1.8 will vote to/not to accept the final report at the San Antonio meeting (June 1996).

VI.       Liaison reports.

• Sheila Hayter reported TC 1.10, Energy Resources, is still in its infant stages of TC development. A formal definition for the committee has just been accepted by the ASHRAE Technical Council. The committee is small but its members and corresponding members are enthusiastic and ready to help the committee grow. The committee plans to submit program ideas for the Philadelphia meeting (January 1997) on sustainability in buildings. They also discussed developing a series of one-pagers for the ASHRAE Journal covering emerging technologies for energy sources. No specific action from TC 1.8 was requested by TC 1.10 members.
• Kirk Bond reported TC 1.7, Operations and Maintenance Management, is interested in developing guidelines for the training required for building operators. Members of TC 1.7 have invited TC 1.8 to help develop these guidelines. TC 1.8 members expressed a interest to help as needed.
• Barry Bridges reported TC 4.6, Building Operations Dynamics, discussed many topics related to optimization and that members of this TC are interested in being aware of operating and maintenance issues. This is a well established committee that at this point do not seem to show much interest in TC 1.8 activities except to recognize their importance to all HVAC related activities.

VII.      Unfinished business/new business.

• David Guckelberger requested 2 hours for a handbook subcommittee meeting at the next ASHRAE meeting (San Antonio, June 1996).
• Barry Bridges announced the Smart Buildings/Smart Building Systems task group (TG) that may be formed in the near future and questioned how TC 1.8 should be involved. If the TG forms, Joe Watson plans to become involved. Otherwise, TC 1.8 members felt the scope of the TG is beyond the scope of TC 1.8.
• Sheila Hayter announced the ASHRAE Continuing Education Committee (CEC) offers training workshops on HVAC related topics for a fee at ASHRAE meetings. CEC is interested in new workshop ideas as well as volunteers to develop new courses. Sheila asked that if anyone attending the TC 1.8 meeting had ideas to please contact her.
• Wayne Robertson recommended to change the TC 1.8 meeting time at ASHRAE Winter and Annual meetings from 3:30 - 6:00 on Tuesday to 2:15 - 4:15 on Monday. The advantage is that TC 1.8 subcommittee meetings, which typically occur on Sunday, and the TC 1.8 meeting would then occur closer to each other, reducing the time some members would need to attend ASHRAE meetings (optimizing volunteer time). Voting members of TC 1.8 agreed to request this time change.
• Wayne Robertson stressed the importance of in TC 1.8 subcommittee meetings to discuss TC 1.8 issues before the main committee meeting. He encouraged everyone to participated in these subcommittee meetings. He continued to remind the committee of the importance for everyone to participate as much as possible in all committee activities especially because TC 1.8 is a small committee.
• Wayne Robertson solicited volunteers to be liaisons to the following TCs: TC 9.6, Systems Energy Utilization - Wayne Webster and Kirk Bond; TC 9.9, Building Commissioning - Barry Bridges; TC 9.1, Large Building Air-Conditioning Systems - Sheila Hayter; and TC 6.1, Hydronic and Steam Heating Systems and Equipment - Jim Schlachter.
• The ASHRAE Journal continues to solicit articles. Wayne Robertson has a list of planned topics for the next several months. Contact Wayne for this list. The ASHRAE Journal also would like a liaison from all TCs. Mil Buckley volunteered.
• Wayne Robertson announced the ASHRAE home page on the internet and recommended all attendees with internet access to review it.

VIII. The TC 1.8 meeting adjourned at 5:15 p.m.

Attachment A

Technical Committee 1.8, Owning and Operating Costs

ASHRAE Winter Meeting, Atlanta, GA

February 21, 1996

Agenda

Call to Order, Quorum

Welcome and Introductions

Recognition of Guests

Minute of Last Meeting, Approval Vote

Handbook Subcommittee Report - David Guckelberger

• vote on handbook motion

Programs Subcommittee Report - Peter Rojeski

• Forum 30 - Kirk Bond

Report from Liaisons

• 1.10 - Sheila Hayter
• 1.7 - David Underwood or Kirk Bond
• 4.6 - Barry Bridges

Unfinished Business

New Business

Announcements

• Sign Up Sheet
• notify TC Secretary of changes of address or phone
• email addresses wanted
• Meetings on a different day in the future
• Subcommittee mtgs most impt
• TC members and CMs must be active
• TC liaisons wanted for 6.2, 6.9, 9.6, & 9.9. Others?
• Journal articles wanted, Journal liaison wanted
• ASHRAE home page

Summarize and Adjourn

Attachment B

Handbook Subcommittee Meeting Minutes

February 18, 1996

I.          Introductions (10 people attended)

II.         Chapter Review

            A.        Handbook reviewers reported no mistakes requiring revision by addendum

            B.         No removed/missing information for special publications

III.       Chapter Revisions

            A.        Review of logistics

                        1)         First draft due June 1996

                        2)         D. Guckelberger to send revision package

            B.         Discussion of proposed changes

                        1)         Economics Section

                                    a)         improve description of terms

                                    b)         add information on computer programs

                                    c)         rearrange section as required

                                    d)         check Table 1, all information needed for program input

                        2)         Operating Costs - B. Thomaston

                                    a)         effect of open access on electrical rates

                                    b)         marginal fuel costs

                                    c)         general section review

                        3)         Innovative Financing Alternatives - J. Watson, W. Robertson

                                    a)         performance contracting

                                    b)         Refrigerant phase out

                        4)         Maintenance Costs - R. Hermans, D. Guckelberger

                                    a)         review data

                                    b)         add service contracts as an estimating method

                                    c)         clarify intent of Table 4

                                    d)         add research data if available

                        5)         Owning Costs - R. Cox

                                    a) review content

                        6)         References and Bibliography - W. Robertson

                                    a)         check availability of sources

                                    b)         check that all references are used in the chapter

                        7)         Index - all revisers

                                    a)         list key words for indexing

IV.       Wrap-up

            A.        Assignments made as listed above

            B.         Revision materials to revisers by March 1 - D. Guckelberger

1. Revisions to Guckelberger by April 26

 

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